Joel Corrigan Said What?

June 13, 2011

“I think this is a great encouragement for us to get away from that emotional decision we can sometimes make say in a service or in an opportunity to give. But rather to seek God in those quiet times, or I guess away from the emotional moment of a service so that we come prepared, ready to give a gift that is worthy or reflecting of the great things he has done in our life.” – Joel Corrigan, 0:17, Giving Video 2 part 2, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bp-qWgFiKeY. (Accessed 26/08/10, 1:54pm)

“Giving to the gospel should be our highest priority with our money. Nothing should come before that. If you look at the Old Testament it talks about the tithe being our First Fruits. When we set our budget or when we steward our money, the first thing we should do is set aside a generous sacrificial gift that we’re willing and ready to bring to the house of God to further the work of the gospel.” – Joel Corrigan, 1:10, Giving Video 2 part 2, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bp-qWgFiKeY (Accessed 26/08/10, 1:54pm)

“It doesn’t matter what we face or what we’re gonna go through, God will make a way for us to be able to give to that and see that vision or that plan or that strategy fulfilled. How are we going to get into all the high schools on the Northern Beaches? God will provide a way. He will provide grace that will empower people to give into that ministry so we can see them change. Same thing with how we’re going to reach Sydney. God will empower people by grace to come prepared willing and ready to give to that ministry so that we can take the gospel all throughout Sydney.” – Joel Corrigan, 1:12, Giving Video 2 part 2, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bp-qWgFiKeY(Accessed 26/08/10, 1:54pm)

“If we align with him and get on board, we have the amazing privelege to be part of one of the greatest moves that we’ve ever seen in the history of the church and that’s seeing our city change.” – Joel Corrigan, 1:19, Giving Video 2 part 2, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bp-qWgFiKeY(Accessed 26/08/10, 1:54pm)

“So to recap guys, I just want to encourage you to move away from making that emotional decision in a service. But rather to seek God outside of that context and determine what you should give in your heart.” – Joel Corrigan, 2:58, Giving Video 2 part 2, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bp-qWgFiKeY. (Accessed 26/08/10, 1:54pm)
(Edit: Some people are disputing the originallity of these quotes. I Quoted Joel Corrigan along with his YouTube video on Facebook. It looks as though some saw it and some didn’t when C3 decided to take it down straight away. Check out that moment here: https://preachersaidwhat.wordpress.com/2011/06/13/joel-corrigan-said-what/original_corrigan_exposed/)



  1. Consider PSW? to be like a mirror. Let the mirror do the talking. I’m simply holding it up so preachers can see what they are saying. There is no difference to a church posting up their preaching videos or putting out books, and me and transcribing them so people can see what they are saying.

    I think this approach is both and acceptable behaviour. The issue I have with this myslef, (as I’m sure you’d agree with), is that it’s fairly selecetive. I am looking at studying journalism to see how I can be more effective in reporting fairly. It’s a very fine line as truth is such a very touchy and aggressive subject in today’s postmodern, fell-good culture.

    Please understand I do take comments to heart and do my best to listen to the harshest of criticisms and apply sound judgment. I need to be open for correction. Thanks to all those who have commented respectfully and have challenged my motives on PSW?.

  2. Jake, no problem.

    I don’t have a dog in this fight, but you need to decide “who” you’re going to be. Facebook Jake or WordPress Jake. You leave yourself wide open for criticism, probably justifiable, if you continue with a split personality approach. And like it or not a lot of people will see you and the contents of this blog to be disrespectful and rude. This will never be a place of respectful dialogue because you are attacking things many people believe in and are committed to. You’re also telling them what they believe is wrong and that they have not the capacity to discern it. You’re basically telling them they’re dumb. Doesn’t go down too well, as you can see.

    Just as you hold passionately to your point of view, the defenders of churches like C3 and Hillsong also hold passionately to theirs. You may very well be in a lose-lose situation. The more you hit out the more your reputation is damaged and any possibility you may have had to open doors and seek dialogue with them will disappear. Though ‘That Guy’ is doing C3 no favors by taking the lower road of just calling you names. So, maybe he could put a name to his comments. Maybe he could ‘man up’ and be taken as more than just a troll. Time will tell.

    Do I think there are issues in the big churches? Yeah. Do I think a change is needed long term? Yeah. But I think it will come about only by genuinely speaking the truth in love. One needs also to leave room and time for the holy spirit to move on people’s hearts. People on both sides of the discussion.


  3. Well Said Sam. Love how you worded the following.

    “And like it or not a lot of people will see you and the contents of this blog to be disrespectful and rude. This will never be a place of respectful dialogue because you are attacking things many people believe in and are committed to. You’re also telling them what they believe is wrong and that they have not the capacity to discern it. You’re basically telling them they’re dumb.”

    That is EXACTLY how I have felt and also a few others who i know have seen this blog site. While Jake has complete freedom to write what he wants, by simply mentioning the names of preachers on here he is not only questioning their credibility in their ministry but also making statements about their personal characters (and i am sure you do not personally know all these men and women to be able to call them all liars). I think it is just not very nice and simply plain rude to call someone a liar in a public forum.

    I know our God is bigger and greater beyond anything we as humans can ever comprehend. What astounds me is that he CHOOSES to use humanity which is riddled with sin and faults. Yes these pastors are human and so are you and I, Jake, yet God chooses to use us regardless. I believe that these pastors are on the right track (and their rights or intentions of rights must outweigh their wrongs) simply because of the size of their ministries… I believe that if these men and women were “fruitcakes” or “false Prophets” then God in all his infinate wisdom would not let their ministries get to the size that they are and reach His next generation in such a massive way.

    “Unless the Lord build the house, they labour in vain that build it” Ps 127.1. These men and women couldn’t create churches this big from Ego or striving alone!

    Never have we seen a generation so absorbed in sin and things are are opposed to God and His Holiness. These men and women are bringing Godly morals, wisdom to a generation who otherwise would be going down a alternate route. The media pushes sex, drug and the self seeking lifestyle. These men an women are promoting love, acceptance, forgiveness as well as dealing with many of the larger issues of life.

    As for the money side of things, I personally pay my tithe and give offerings. Not out of compulsion but out of love for God, obedience to his word ,
    and belief in the work of the ministry. After all it DOES TAKE MONEY to preach the gospel and run a church these days.

    Week after week I sit in a beautiful building (I helped pay for) and hear about the ministries that are touching my community (that i am helping fund). I have a network of pastors that are preaching Gods word, praying for the sick in hospitals, visiting families at 3am in the morning when an emergency happens, spending hours listening and helping people through life situations (I am helping pay for these peoples wages). There are also free councelling services, Free church ammenities to disability programs and community food programs (That i am funding). This is MY ministry because not only have i invested MY TIME but also MY MONEY in giving to God. You will know if someone is TRUELY a part of something if they “put their money where their mouth is!”

    Also just for clarification: When i tithe I actually am doing so with a joyous heart with the attitude that I am giving to GOD and not to a man or an institution. I CHOOSE to tithe and give offerings. If i didnt want to… i wouldn’t.

    Jake, Let me leave you with 1 thing. “A man with an EXPERIENCE is NEVER at the mercy of a man with a PHILOSOPHY!. You may post all these articles and may persuade SOME people but those who have had an experience contrary to your opinion will never be swayed. I personally have experienced and witnessed incredible healing in my life, amazing provision, an inner peace that while i know nothing philosophical about God, that i actually KNOW him.

    I can only hope the same for you my brother.

    Thats my 2 cents! Bless you all…. and lets keep this clean!

  4. “While Jake has complete freedom to write what he wants, by simply mentioning the names of preachers on here he is not only questioning their credibility in their ministry but also making statements about their personal characters.”

    True. And I hope Christian’s, that have been given the holy scriptures, the Spirit of God and the mind of Christ will also question the credibility of the people and their ministries. You are doing so with me, so I hope you can do so with them.

    People are making personal statements about my character. Good. I hope you ask these same fair and honest questions about these men. To be a teacher of God’s word is a huge responsibility and should not be taken flippantly. Not many should be teachers or they will be severely judged by God.

    James 3:1 “Not many of you should presume to be teachers, my brothers, because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly.”

    People need to read their bibles and simply heed the sound instruction of the biblical text. Judge me in comparison to what the word of God says. Please go to proper biblical scholars who have actually earnt proper doctorates in their proper handling of scriptures.

  5. I love it how you are insinuating I am a proud, mislead, dangerous young man when you:

    1. Don’t know me.
    2. Seem to also have read into the above statement that ‘I never struggle with pride’.

    Your prejudice is foul against me and it is obvious that you read things into my comments that simply aren’t there. Clean up your attitude, read your bible and then dialogue with me when you’ve examined the intentions of your heart.

    There is love – then there is true love. Christ defines what true love is. You are judging me out of complete spite and prejudice, ripping me out of context and reading into comments things that aren’t there.

    Why are you doing this? It’s not Christian behaviour. On the other hand, I am being judged because I simply quoting pastors? I am NOT quoting them out of context and yet Christians- CHRISTIANS like yourselves are reacting.

    What to?

  6. any insult will be deleted. that was below the belt and incredibly unChristian.

  7. I like the part where he said “read your bible.”

  8. Yeah, that part looks like fun too. I wish I could be self-righteous too.

  9. Oh you can!!

    It’s so easy!!

    You just hide behind blogs and stuff and make really wildly rude judgements on everyone and anyone!

    It’s great!

    Did I mention that I’m single and live at home with my mum and dad??

  10. Why did you censor my comment Jake?

  11. Now, Jake, I hope you’re not slandering yourself there. 😉

  12. This is unbelievable. what complete slander and mockery.

    Your attacks are completely uncalled for and unfounded.

    The way you are responding to each other to bring my name to shame is completely unChristian and not founded at all.

    I can’t believe you accuse me of being judgmental when you are encouraging such ungodly behaviour. If you are Christian, I am ashamed of your behaviour.

    If you go to C3 and this is you trying to defend Joel Corrigan’s reputation – you’re making both C3 and his reputation look worse by your foul comments.

    Please consider this when you are posting. You are really not looking C3 look better with these comments nor Joel Corrigan.

  13. apparently “judge not, lest ye be judged” does not mean what every other person on earth thinks it means.

  14. “Funny how this blogger can’t handle a little bit of his own medicine when people pass judgement on his behaviour….”

    This isn’t my ‘own medicine’. I am simply putting up actual facts. I am providing the sources, the locations and what pastors are actually saying in context. And it seems you have a problem with this. It looks as though both you and I see why.

    However this so-called ‘little bit of his own medicine’ is another lie. This is you going out of your way to curse and spite me and it is awful. It is slander, abusive and unChristian.

    If you protest with a reasonable and factual claim about what is written, I am more then open to discuss and change things that are necessary. In fact, talking with someone from C3 tonight, I am hoping to remove a preacher’s comment from this blog- because I am hoping they will see what they have said and take it back.

    That would be great. Back off the spiting and these nasty attacks and be reasonable. That is all I ask. Why are you choosing to be so ugly when you can be reasonable human being?

  15. “apparently “judge not, lest ye be judged” does not mean what every other person on earth thinks it means.”

    i sincerely ask you to read your bible in context with this passage. I believe that you are more then capable in understanding what this scripture does mean in context and how this fits in with New Testament teachings on judgment.

  16. It’s ok jakey my precious little angel… Mummy still loves you!!


  17. “i sincerely ask you to read your bible in context with this passage. I believe that you are more then capable in understanding what this scripture does mean in context and how this fits in with New Testament teachings on judgment.”

    You mean the context of:
    “Do not judge others, and you will not be judged. For you will be treated as you treat others.[a] The standard you use in judging is the standard by which you will be judged.”

    [a]“For God will judge you as you judge others.”

    Certainly hope you come to this realisation soon.

  18. Don’t be silly, Aninnymouse, you’re clearly not reading your Bible.

    And Jake, what part of “love keeps no record of wrongs” is this whole site complying with?

  19. Leave my little jakey-poohs alone!

  20. Hey Aninnymouse – it’s bad to see you being selective with scriptures AND translations. Why would you go to the New LOOSE Translation (NLT) to read into something of Jesus that is simply not there? That is not at all what the scripture means.

    “Certainly hope you come to this realisation soon.”
    Is that a judgment of yours Aninnymouse?

    That scripture, ‘love keeps no records of wrongs’ CW – once again that is out of context. Read your bible. You clearly do not know what you are talking about and this is down right a sad sight to see Christians argue things they do not know.

    Selecting and quoting out of context scripture, mocking, slandering and personally attacking me AND my family – shame on you. It looks as though you are trying to defend C3 or Corrigan by your behaviour. You are making Joel Corrigan and C3 church look incredibly bad by your behaviour.

    Some of you here might want to clarify if you are or not since it really looks as though you are of C3.

  21. Please understand I am more then happy engage with biblical conversation – but if people are carelessly using scriptures and parroting error like they have done so above, please go back to your bibles and read them yourselves.

    http://www.blueletterbible.com is a good site that can make you examine a large variety of translations and can allow you to examine the bible in Greek in Hebrew definitions.

  22. “Out of context” seems to be your only argument against the scripture we quote. Yet you never actually explain what the context is. Poir form, Jake. It’s almost as if you don’t actually have a case there.

  23. It especially isn’t helping things for you to say you’re happy to enage in biblical conversation, when your side is completely lacking in biblical content.

  24. As usual Jake you are spot on with the heretics of false teaching and the sheep that follow it. I wonder if anyone on here defending these horrid false teachers would meet with you face to face and say what they are instead of hiding behind the Internet? I’m prepared to meet people in New Zealand and say they are false teachers.

  25. As ex-C3, I would love to see those still attending engage in some serious biblical analysis of sermons they are hearing every Sunday. To quote Chris Rosebrough from “Fighting For The Faith” we certainly find some good, a lot bad but sadly some very ugly. A shepherd is called to tend and feed the flock sheep food, not a steady diet of lifestyle “it’s all about you” messages, most of which can be found on Dr Phil (the real one). And I find there is a lot of Law and very little Grace.

  26. And I find it very sad to have come to this position after attending C3 for 22 years – we gave up a lot by leaving C3, it impacted on friendships and family relationships. We now find ourselves at Newport Anglican Church where the members are very well fed……because it’s all about Christ and not about us.

  27. Anyone want to have a real conversation on here or just attack the blogger and not the issues that were posted by him? Thanks Jake, Margot, Quentin and even Sam for bringing some balance to this and anyone else who may have brought a reasonable response. All I can say is it must be true (links or no links) for the reaction and attack on this blogger to be so strong and ridiculous as to be juvenile. Anyone want to discuss the “tithe” scripture and verse? Or should we go to works based faith? God bless you Jake, may God continue to use you .

  28. Sure, let’s all attack the issue. I already am, I’m just following Jake’s example, which is not so much a sensible discussion of issues as it is a hate-filled smear campaign.
    Don’t like my choice of words, Jake? Hey, contempt breeds contempt.

  29. In future youtube or video clips I will do screen grabs as further proof of the content.

    The attack started with false ministers attacking God and his church. You are clearly following their example by the way they attack and slander those who question their teachings and ministry.

  30. I have listened to no one attacking God. True they have made mention of people who question what they do. I would not call it slander because no names are mention. Telling the likes of you to get a life is also in no way an attack; rather, it’s quite good advice you should take. It’s like your every moment is spent trying to bring down something that God desires. That, and avoiding questions. Still waiting to hear your answer on what the correct context of “love keeps no record of wrongs” is.

  31. “Still waiting to hear your answer on what the correct context of “love keeps no record of wrongs” is.”

    And rather then have what I say fall on deaf ears by someone say, ‘that’s your opinion’, I’m telling you to read the bible so you can clearly see what that means yourself. Chew on it and enjoy what comes out of it.

  32. I’ve done that! It’s black-and-white! How can it mean anything other than that literal interpretation?

  33. And, might I add, avoid avoid avoid…

  34. “True they have made mention of people who question what they do. I would not call it slander because no names are mention.”

    Labels range from critics, bloggers or those who question as the following:

    Demon possessed.
    Spiritually dead.
    Satan’s workers.
    Satan’s minions.
    Spirit of criticism. (or Critical spirit)
    Spirit of cynicism. (Or cynical spirit)
    Spirit of backsliding.
    Agent of Satan.
    Heresy hunters.
    Division causers.
    Worthless filth.
    Children of hell.

    Insults range from:
    “Get some balls!”
    “Get a job!”
    “Get a spine!”
    “They are faceless, graceless and faithless!”

    I was hearing these before I started my Facebook campaign and PSW. Now I’m seeing ‘pleb see, pleb do’. These men are not to be questioned and go out of their way to make you think the way they want you to think about those who raise questions about them. They present themselves in a way they cannot be wrong and elevate themselves as prophets, teachers, leaders, etc, therefore infallible.

    So people cannot question them but they make you question ANYONE who questions them and paint those who have valid points as such expressed in the list. They don’t have to mention names – they’ve painted fearful brushstrokes in peoples minds and have completely stereotyped ANYONE who wishes to dispute them biblically.

  35. But are PEOPLE’S names mentioned? No. Not slander.
    And what’s more, you’re criticising people for calling you names, and at the same time labelling Pringle, Houston and others with names like anti-christ, and well, several names you’ve claimed you yourself have been called! So, might I add another name, just for you: hypocrite!

  36. Actually – my name has been mentioned and I have been openly slandered by C3 leadership on numerous occasions. Their accusations were wrong and were based on misinformation.

    Do you know how often I’ve been accused of being people I am not? I do my best to preach the scripture in context and rightly accept correction if I am in error. I back up my claims with proof.

    Ephesians 4 teaches us how we are to be united in Truth and Spirit about Christ – so we may grow in the fullness of Him. But this is the same Christ who loved with one hand and condemned the false with the other. This is who we are to grow into. And it is Christ who is Light and Love. And it was Christ who kept account of the wrongs of the Pharisees (Matt 23) and the churches of Revelations (Rev 2-3), as was Paul who kept in account the wrongs done at the Corinthian Church.

    1Corinthians 13 ‘love keeps no account of wrong’ would make Paul himself a hypocrite as this entire ‘love chapter’ is used to reveal exactly what the Corinthian Church wasn’t. Paul is clearly keeping an account of wrong in both 1 & 2 Corinthians, Romans, Galatians, etc. Paul then refers himself as putting childish ways behind him in 1Cor 13, indicating that is what the Corinthian Church needed to do- put away their childish ways.

    He was keeping account of their wrongs – and rightly so. It was the super apostles, the gnostic, sophist, soothsaying, ‘servants of satan’, preachers dividing the church. It was this clamor to success that was making the Corinthian church unloving, foolish, selfish and childish. They weren’t patient, humble, forgiving, merciful, listening, etc.

    Paul got incredibly foul with his language in these letters and appropriately labeled the dividers many names.

    Have you considered that forgiveness works two ways? I can forgive someone in my heart but that doesn’t mean they accept I forgive them. If I chose to keep no account of their wrong, I may as well be an abused wife, always forgiving my husband and letting go of all wrong as he continually beats up me and my family. That is an absence of wisdom and common sense – which the bible says we should not forsake.

    On the other hand, when the recipient of our forgiveness receives us and our forgiveness AND changes their ways, then love truly keeps no account of wrong. Is this not a basic fundamental to Christianity in how we are saved and how we are spared the judgment of God?

    It is my desire to see the body of Christ function. I recently got in contact with someone from C3 who knew Sheralyn Bucknell. I asked them to notify her of what I have put up on PSW? about her. She is a beautiful woman and I honestly wonder if she meant what she said. I quoted her because what she preached was not Christianity but the opposite to the teachings of the New Testament.

    She is a genuine believer and I am holding her accountable. If she is horrified by what she said and realises what she has said is wrong and apologises, then I will be rejoicing in what is good and I THEN will take it down because I may have seen that she is genuine in her faith towards God. This demonstrates that I do not hold to account wrong.

    If any preacher commented on here to apologise or respond with genuine shock of what they’ve said, I will be happy that they rejoice with me in what it is good. Then I will also take it down to prove that I no longer hold their mistake against them.

    That is love. I wish to see all ministers accountable to the standards of God’s love revealed through the gospel. If they genuinely change their ways for the love of God and for his people, then I will keep no account of their wrong because of their love for God and the body.

    Is this not reasonable? Is this not biblical and commonsense?
    I hope you receive what I have said in the right way. Thanks for your dialogue Craig Wilson.

  37. I’m out. I give up. You’re not going to see sense. You think love is listing every wrong someone does and beating them over the head with it til they apologise? I weep for your future children.

  38. Jake,

    Where do you get scriptural authority to speak against a church you are not involved in?

    Paul actually had leadership over the churches he corrected, you are just a bitter critic. Some of what you say is actually correct. But the spirit and way in which you come is not in love. Love is proven, Anyone can bring correction and call it love…Love has investment…love actually comes beside someone to correct…it does not take cheap shots(whether they be true or not) from the side.

    You are unteachable, Anyone with a contrary view to yours is told to read their bible. Last i checked you are not jesus in the flesh and you can be very wrong…and in the view of many you are.

    I would suggest you go back and read your posts..look at your attitude…your answer to any critic is “read your bible” or “stop slandering me”

    You have an issue with the church using old testament to justify tithing..which i can see your point with. Yet you have an old testament view on love and correction.
    Where grace comes after repentance. Pretty sure without his grace you have nothing to stand on.

    I doubt you will actually listen to any of this, you have made up your mind and anyone who does agree obviously needs to read their bible right? Because you seem to have the correct revelation many people are missing.
    Which is actual arrogance and pride.

    If you are a critic expect people to be critics of you too. And while you may point out some valid holes and issues…equally holes and issues will show up about you.

    Lets hope the plank in your eye is not too big…

  39. Also the love you describe sounds like it is motivated by fear, Fear of being hurt again so you cannot forget wrongs. Yes wisdom is needed but so called wisdom is often a cover for fear.

    Perfect love drives out all fear, It is not reactionary. Has nothing to hide.

    You want to see a real example of love? look at jesus with the woman at the well…he did not beat her over the head.

    Look at jesus on the cross…he did not rebuke those who were crucifying him. Jesus is perfect love. Maybe follow his example and not rely on the letters of paul for your view on love. Paul knew the love…jesus Is the love.

  40. I am simply asking people to read their bible in context. This is the first thing we are taught to do in bible college. Why are people offended by this sincere, simple request?

    1. Read the bible in context.
    2. Ask God to guide them by the Spirit when reading.
    3. Turn on the discernment button.

    Please stop these slanderous attacks.

  41. Jake “THE SNAKE” Elliot everybody!

    the only man ever to be able to truly read the bible in context….

  42. And you dont answer my question.

    1. My bible tells me the love you preach is not biblical love that is demonstrated by christ…who IS love…not has love.
    2. The holy spirit does not resonate in me with such blatent and slanderous attacks on men of God
    3. Discernment works both ways…a few people now have discerned you as coming not from the right spirit. Yet you refuse to go get help.

    If you do not like being criticised then do not become the critic of another….You are being judged by the same scriptural standard you are deeming to judge these men. Your interpretation of love comes up lacking of christ.

  43. @ Jake – honest biblical dialogue with those who have concerns about C3 teaching/sermons/doctrine is unlikely here as long as immature comments pop up from “Rupert G Barnsworth” …….is this an indication of the level of spiritual maturity of those attending? Shame on the shepherds if so.

    “Wally” (if that’s your real name) does make some fair observations. Open up a discussion that allows those who have spent many years there and care for those still attending, to be heard.

  44. I think everyone has some immaturity in them, no matter how old they are: Rupert calls people names. I’m in my mid-20s and laugh at fart jokes. Jake cries slander to everything he doesn’t agree to or like to hear…

  45. I attended full-time bible college at C3 and graduated in the top 6. If those same assignments I received 95% plus marks for, were put before a review board of, let’s say Moore Theological College today, I would receive a resounding FAIL! I’m seriously upset to see passing marks given by untrained lecturers, having paid $3000+ (back in 1990). Still, ignorance on my part is unacceptable too. I’m as much to blame for not being Berean.

    After attending for 22 years, were we looking for a reason to leave? No, it was the Lord’s sovereign grace in allowing “the scales to fall off our eyes” and see His Word being misused. It was rather like seeing what’s underneath the tip of an iceberg. It was painful, it was the hardest thing we have ever done, walking away from friends, being dropped by “friends” to be more precise, misunderstood by family, yet finally finding a church that honours Gods Word and finding comfort at last in His total sovereignty and unmerited grace.

    I highly recommend a lecture by Dr Rod Rosenbladt, a Lutheran theologian, called “The Gospel For Those Broken By The Church”. Just google, read or listen.

  46. We are part of a large group of (unacknowledged) ex-C3 long term members. We run into others all the time, and they almost always say they left for the same reasons. These are solid, mature, believers, hurting and sad but rejoicing to find themselves in other churches ( usually Reformed) where the Gospel is preached faithfully.

    People who leave are generally viewed as dissenters who don’t support the “vision” – that “vision” more important than faithful exegesis. Although I hesitate to use the word, having left C3, feels like leaving a cult, the reprogramming required is quite serious.

  47. Really? Cause I recomment Ps Phil’s “Healing the Wounded Spirit” for anyone who’s been as messed up as I have been letting Jake’s crap get into their thoughts. I was spiritually dead for months because of this guy. And it wasn’t like a “that means you should try another church” kind of thing. I did. Different churches, same result.

  48. Im not suggesting c3 has it all together i am not suggesting anyone is wrong for leaving ether. I am less then impressed with some of what they say/do but i equally do not agree with jake’s approach and some of his views

    But some of what jakes says is spot on…i think most people can see that.

    P.S i am an C3 bible college graduate too so i am not blind to the rubbish that can go on.

  49. I’m sorry to hear you have been ” messed up” but it was 22 years of Phil’s take on doctrine that messed our lives up. We are so grateful for not only the two Anglican ministers who counselled and prayed for us but also for the faithful preaching of a true Gospel we heard as we started listening to John Macarthur on the Internet in the months leading up to our finally leaving C3.

    My husband went to Phil privately sharing our concerns about the lack of Gospel preaching and also told him we were listening to John Macarhur. Phil didn’t like that because he thinks Macarthur doesn’t like the prosperity doctrine Phil preaches – we had to tell Phil we didn’t like the prosperity doctrine either and we had no option but to leave….a church may have a doctrinal statement that says all the right things but it’s what comes from the pulpit that displays a man’s true leanings. So very sad, so very bad…..

  50. “Jake cries slander to everything he doesn’t agree to or like to hear…”

    I actually correctly cry slander to those who don’t realise they do it.

  51. “Jake cries slander to everything he doesn’t agree to or like to hear…”

    I actually correctly cry slander to those who don’t realise they do it.

    do you even know what the definition of slander is? sounds like you can “correct” or actually defame/slander preachers but if anyone uses the same standard on you…you cry slander and play the victim card.

    Creating a blog speaking against various preaches and throwing accusations at them some of which cannot be proven outside your perception of scripture is slander/defamation.

    If you created a blog about anyone in the world like this…they would have you in front of the courts quick smart.

  52. @ Wally – how would you define “taking the Lord’s name in vain”?

  53. What’s that got to do with Jake’s claims that we slander him, or our claims that Jake slanders pastors?

  54. @ Sid – the question was addressed to Wally but since you ask……

    When a pastor, let’s say Phil Pringle (but can apply to ANY pastor), says something God did not say, they are taking the Lord’s Name in vain. In essence God has a reputation to protect. He will not have someone saying “thus sayeth the Lord” if in fact He has not spoken!! Making untrue or false claims about God’s Word is no different (rather like slander don’t you think?) And can we discuss how many false prophecies have come from the pulpit? One false prophecy makes one a false prophet……just stating the facts, folks.

  55. When we misrepresent Christ, either intentionally or through ignorance of the Christian faith as proclaimed in Scripture, we take the Lord’s name in vain.

    When legalistic claims (tithing etc)are made and applied to New Testament believers, that is a form of slander, in other words, saying something God didn’t say/apply ……

  56. You see Jake’s claims about Phil as slander, and from your perspective as a C3 member, I understand why. But when we apply the biblical text and context to Jake’s claims and Phil’s sermons etc, “Houston we have a problem”…..

  57. What context? Jake couldn’t provide context to a simple bible verse further up without stalling for a few hours and then providing some longwinded answer that sounded like he pulled it straight from his ass, in an attempt to cover said ass after accusing someone of not reading the verse in context.

  58. @ Sid – apart from being crass, what biblical evidence are you providing? Are you allowing your experience to define scripture or using scripture to define your church experience as true or false?

    You use strong words but don’t give scripture to back up your statements. I don’t agree with Jake’s approach at times and he knows that, but he is providing a lot of biblical evidence to define false teaching. Sid, with respect, we spent 22 years there as leaders and lay pastors, so we don’t come to this discussion without some “inside” knowledge

  59. A good example of legalism or “quid pro quo” is the statement by Joel Corrigan…….

    “If we align with him and get on board, we have the amazing privelege to be part of one of the greatest moves that we’ve ever seen in the history of the church and that’s seeing our city change.”

    Adding to the finished work of Christ. What if we don’t align or get on board? Will the Lord lose any the Father has given Him? NO!

    John 6:39 ESV “And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day.”

  60. Margot until that last statement you were approaching this discussion with a refreshing sense of maturity.

    It is entirely unfair to judge a message and the preacher based on what “isn’t” said and labeling it legalism.

    The parts of this video sermon that has been transcribed by Jake reveals to us that this is obviously a teaching video on the topic giving and therefore the statement that Joel Corrigan made in its context is entirely true.

    It is a privilege to give to the work of the Gospel.

    We don’t deserve anything to do with God, so therefore the fact that by his marvelous grace, He does allow us to take part in reaching his lost children is a great privilege that we should not take for granted.

    We see this in 2 Corinthians 8 where after giving themselves to Christ, the Macedonians begged earnestly for the favor of taking part in the relief of the saints. And this was the Macedonians offering their money, time and resources to further the Gospel through Paul’s ministry.

    If the context of this message had been to preach the Gospel to non-believers to see them come to Christ and then Joel was to say that they had to give to be saved yes your statement would be true.

  61. Unfortunately I couldn’t finish my post, problem with the box attached to the new WordPress commenting (seems to freeze and not allow more comment). I was not happy with my comment either. I can read read betweemn my lines, you can’t! 🙂

    I was going to add that we are saved to do good works and my experience particularly since leaving C3 and being around Christians who simply love the Lord, is seeing them do so much without even being aware of those good works. There is a lot of legalism attached to preaching at C3 – perhaps it’s not their intention but from personal exposure for 22 years, the burden to “perform” was intense.

    Genuine faith in Christ will produce a changed life and good works (James 2:20-26).

    It’s the constant emphasis on money and giving that is at the heart of the “prosperity doctrine” that Phil espouses. This is passed on to the next generation of young believers and I find this deeply troubling.

    Since leaving C3 and being “Berean”, checking other ministries, particularly John Macarthur and John Piper, we realised this is not the road they travel and they speak vehemently against it. Seeing Phil (and Mark Kelsey) still use Malachi as an admonition to unscripturally tithe is just pure biblical ignorance. Doesn’t it bother you that senior pastors still do this? Do they think the “sheep” are not reading their bibles in context and seeing the problem? We love to give as cheerful givers and are heartbroken for those who still come to us for financial advice after getting caught up in the “Vision” and not able to pay their bills. Where is the so-called “100-fold blessing” for them (as if they’re Israelites)?

  62. @ Johnny Be Good – That’s my post above. By the way, what qualifies Joel to instruct on giving? How many years of theological training has Joel had, he’s obviously too young to be an elder. Is he just parroting what he’s heard, not that I don’t understand him doing that, I did the same thing for years!

    We have student ministers coming through our church who are are in their final years at Moore Theological college – they have to do a minimum 2 year stint at different churches and are required to preach. We have had the opportunity to compare the standard of biblical knowledge between C3 and Moore College, and in so saying, not many of these young C3 men would not be allowed in the pulpit of most well-known Reformed churches world-wide

  63. I appreciate the passion of those young men and their desire to serve the Lord, just wish they could be exposed to better instruction in the Word.

    It goes without saying I am a “sovereign grace” believer now and hold to the 5 solas. Spent 22 years unknowingly being an “arminian”, thought my “free will was the standard – having now had our eyes opened to a reformed theology, we have never looked back. Grace, grace, grace……

  64. By the way, what’s with all the pseudonyms? As the parent of a well-known C3 pastor, writing on this blog is my way of saying how seriously concerned I am about false or misleading teaching (in any church or ministry).

    • @ Margot Murray

      But my point still stands – your comment of legalism against Joel in this sermon was unfair and should be retracted.

      Further to that point – the fact that Jake has quoted him to be encouraging people to determine for themselves what they should give away from the emotion of the moment shows that he is not preaching a legalistic approach to giving. Again there is evidence for this in 2 Corinthians 9 where Paul encourages the Corinthian church to give in this way so that their gift is one of grace and not one of exaction.

      It is also unfair to judge his character and motives based on your experience with the ministers from church that you have left even if he is from the same church. Jesus said his disciples would be known by their fruit and not by what church they attend, and again this post from Jake does not do much to show us the fruit of Joel’s relationship with Jesus.

      Also your comment around his qualifications for being an elder/teacher is again entirely unfair for two reasons:

      1. No where in the bible does it say that someone MUST have an institutionalized qualification. If this was so then every new testament teacher is disqualified in your view. I know that this is not what you were doing but for example sake, you could argue the same point you originally raised against Joel, that this is adding to scripture.

      2. You do not know from this post whether or not Joel qualifies against that which is laid out in 1 Timothy 3.


      It is unfair for anyone on this blog to judge Joel or any of the people quoted in the other articles based on anything other than what this blog has put before you. Otherwise this blog is simply causing people to stumble by encouraging them to judge based on assumptions.

      I will also state that it is unfair and not fruitful for everyone to talk to each other they way they have in this comment thread and this is why I said your comments were refreshingly mature.

      Everyone has a right to there opinion and is free to do what he or she likes but I would ask, based on this comment stream – is this blog causing fruitful dialogue that leads to God glorifying fellowship or is it leading to pithy arguments and division?

  65. Point 1. The disciples’ qualifications came from learning from Christ – no higher authority. Paul also taught by Christ.

    Point 2. 1 Tim 3 ESV – context,context, context. Joel is not old enough. We went through this at church last week (we actually go verse by verse and historical context as well, no lifestyle, it’s all about you stuff)- there is an aspect here that indicates an older man quite clearly.

    Causing people to stumble would never be my intention but using scripture out of context or cherry-picking scriptures to make a point does.

    “The saying is trustworthy: If anyone aspires to the office of overseer, he desires a noble task. 2Therefore an overseer must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, sober-minded, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, not a drunkard, not violent but gentle, not quarrelsome, not a lover of money. He must manage his own household well, with all dignity keeping his children submissive, for if someone does not know how to manage his own household, how will he care for God’s church? He must not be a recent convert, or he may become puffed up with conceit and fall into the condemnation of the devil. Moreover, he must be well thought of by outsiders, so that he may not fall into disgrace, into a snare of the devil.”

    • So what age is old enough?

      Who gets to decide?

      This is starting to sound a lot like legalism Margot.

      The following is the commentary from the ESV study bible which I believe is endorsed by some of the ministers you have highlighted earlier as people you respect and agree with.


      1 Tim. 3:2–3 Above reproach heads the list as the key qualification for an overseer; it is then expounded by the words and phrases that follow in these verses (see note on Titus 1:6). The meaning of husband of one wife (Gk. mias gynaikos andra) is widely debated. The Greek phrase is not common, and there are few other instances for comparison. The phrase literally states, “of one woman [wife] man [husband].” (1) Many commentators understand the phrase to mean “having the character of a one-woman man,” that is, “faithful to his wife.” In support of this view is the fact that a similar phrase is used in 1 Tim. 5:9 as a qualification for widows (Gk. henos andros gynē; “one-man woman,” i.e., “wife of one husband”), and in that verse it seems to refer to the trait of faithfulness, for a prohibition of remarriage after the death of a spouse would be in contradiction to Paul’s advice to young widows in 5:14. Interpreters who hold this first view conclude that the wording of 3:2 is too specific to be simply a requirement of marriage and not specific enough to be simply a reference to divorce or remarriage after divorce. In the context of this passage, the phrase therefore prohibits any kind of marital unfaithfulness. (2) Another view is that “husband of one wife” means polygamists cannot be elders. Interpreters who hold this view note that there is evidence of polygamy being practiced in some Jewish circles at the time. On this view, the phrase means “at the present time the husband of one wife,” in line with other qualifications which refer to present character. On either of these views, Paul is not prohibiting all second marriages; that is, he is not prohibiting from the eldership a man whose wife has died and who has remarried, or a man who has been divorced and who has remarried (these cases should be evaluated on an individual basis). (3) A third view is that Paul is absolutely requiring that an elder be someone who has never had more than one wife. But that does not fit the context as well, with its emphasis on present character. On any of these views, Paul is speaking of the ordinary cases and is not absolutely requiring marriage or children (cf. v. 4) but is giving a picture of the typical approved overseer as a faithful husband and father. able to teach. This is the one requirement in this list that is not necessarily required of all believers. It is also not required of deacons. Thus, it is a distinguishing skill required of the pastor/elder. It yields the only reference in this list to his actual duties (see note on Titus 1:9).

      1 Tim. 3:4–5 The management of one’s own household is highlighted as a qualification for eldership by the greater amount of discussion given to it. The home is the proving ground of Christian character and therefore the preparation field for ministry. This makes further sense in light of the picture of the church as “the household of God” (v. 15).

      1 Tim. 3:6 not be a recent convert, or he may become puffed up with conceit. No matter the level of giftedness, time is needed to demonstrate maturity and character.

      1 Tim. 3:7 The concern for the opinion of outsiders emerges again. There is a concern throughout this letter for how the church (and therefore the gospel) is portrayed to the watching world (cf. 2:2, 10; 5:7, 14; 6:1).

      • I think you skirt around the questions I’m specifically asking. I don’t think the above commentary disqualifies my questions re Joel’s youth, sound biblical training (C3 College doesn’t make the sound theology grade) and experience.

        Having been part of, been very concerned about, tried to discuss with leadership, the often unwise promotion to leadership/connect group leaders etc of very unsuitable people, why would there be any reason to believe things have changed? Especially having dialogued in the past with some very troubling “leaders”. True story – youth leader (female) lauding the merits of “The Shack” as having more impact on her life than the bible, said at youth leaders dinner in our home.

        And in closing, legalism is what we left behind, sovereign grace is what we found, so sorry you don’t see it.

  66. Is Joel have children, does he manage his own household well, keeping his children submissive so as to prove his ability to care for
    God’s church? The bible is quite clear of who is qualified for service in all aspects of church life.

  67. “Jake couldn’t provide context to a simple bible verse further up without stalling for a few hours and then providing some longwinded answer that sounded like he pulled it straight from his ass, in an attempt to cover said ass after accusing someone of not reading the verse in context.”

    That answer I so-called ‘pulled straight from my ass’, was actually what I was taught in my theological class.

  68. “And you dont answer my question.”

    Which question haven’t I answered?

    “My bible tells me the love you preach is not biblical love that is demonstrated by Christ…who IS love…not has love.”

    Do you even read or know the Jesus of the bible? Read Matt 23, John 8-10. Actually read the gospel accounts of Christ. Jesus, who IS love would be considered very divisive and rude in today’s culture.

    “The holy spirit does not resonate in me with such blatent and slanderous attacks on men of God”

    What are you talking about? Are you talking about the articles here that you are finding offensive?

    “Discernment works both ways…a few people now have discerned you as coming not from the right spirit.”

    So you base your level of discernment on other people’s views and not the word of God.

    “If you do not like being criticised then do not become the critic of another….”

    So you acknowledge the fact that you are criticising me yet condemn me for ‘criticising’ when it is these ministers you are defending who say, “Don’t criticize”? I’m the hypocrite?

    These articles are simply recording what they say?

    “You are being judged by the same scriptural standard you are deeming to judge these men.”
    And you are critizing me not to criticize, going against these men who don’t criticize?

    “Your interpretation of love comes up lacking of christ.”

    I’m saying love does criticize – and Jesus and others in the New Testament do. They make people accountable and responsible to God. Your comment above is sounding very condemning.

    You tell me not to judge, yet look at yourself and what you are doing right now! JUDGING! Who seriously has the log?

  69. definition of slander:

    Noun: The action or crime of making a false spoken statement damaging to a person’s reputation.
    Verb: Make false and damaging statements about (someone).

    See that?

    “The action or crime of making a FALSE SPOKEN STATEMENT damaging to a person’s reputation.”

    “Make FALSE and damaging statements about (someone).”

    I am simply recording in the public domain on PSW? what preachers are saying.

  70. @ Margot

    Margot to be clear I am not from C3. I am not even from Australia.

    I am glad you have found a church where you can grow in your faith.

    What I am pointing out is you choosing to judge this Joel Corrigan unfairly from assumptions that you have made about him, which cannot be assertained from Jakes post.

    From where I sit I dont hear great things about the teaching on fellowship with the holy spirit in the Sydney Anglican church but it would be wrong of me to judge you individually based off of a bad reputation about a larger group of people.

    BTW – you STILL have not addressed your unfair legalism claim based on the evidence put forward by this blog.

  71. C3’ers,

    Please, if you want to be taken seriously in this discussion, and you truly, truly believe what you preach, use your real name. It does nothing for your cause when you hide behind an alias, calling people names. You’re brave when you’re anonymous but would you behave this way face to face?

    You’re probably from the ‘Love Is/Change’ community if you’re here arguing with Jake. (No, I don’t know him, at all) and this is a really, really poort representation of your church that you behave in this way. What good is handing out blankets to the homeless in Sydney if you then come here and open your potty mouths with all sorts of ill speech?

    Think about it.

  72. @ Johnny – That’s a judgement call in itself on the Sydney anglican Church. The Holy Spirit is given far more honour in our church than I ever saw over 22 years of “charismania” at C3 – I drank deeply from that muddy well. We study and practice the gifts of the Holy Spirit biblically and in order. Do we speak in tongues? Certainly not the babble practiced in most churches “one or two at most and not without interpretation” is the biblical injuction and even pastors I know personally at C3 know that is not the case at C3. Our minister has made it clear that he, like my husband and I, is not a cessationist and if someone has the biblical of tongues with interpretation following “go for it, or sit down and be quiet”! That’s my kind of biblical pastor….

    Am I in a position to “judge” Joel? Yes, as a Christian definitely! Test ALL things, something we neglected to do for those 22 years.

    • @ Johnny – again that was my post, my computer likes to call me “Teddy” (probably because we have a clever poodle by that name :))

      Getting back to the Sydney Anglican community, the churches we have gone to (two) been far more honest about the work of the Holy Spirit. The so-called “baptism of the Holy Spirit” with evidence of tongues. We are all baptised into one baptism at conversion and the Lord distributes the gifts throughout the body for the edification of that body

      As Paul says quite clearly, “do all speak in tongues?” It’s a negative affirmation – are we to desire the gifts? Yes but again the Lord distributes as He sees fit. The most prayerful people attend our church and get up to honour and testify to His goodness and His will as to answered prayer. It’s been quite an eye-opener

      We don’t yell and clamour and shake and show a lack of self-control, we simply come before Him with our requests with the God-given language He ordained for us (English) and he is wonderful to answer.

      As I have said here before, it’s with great sadness to say we feel like we have left a cult (or cult-like atmosphere because we still have loved ones there who truly love the Lord and have begun to question too, now that’s the Holy Spirit at work) – the aberrant spiritual mindsets we had to get of only came about through the ministry and prayer of two faithful, kind Anglican ministers. As one family member who attends C3 said after visiting our little Anglican church, “well, you certainly don’t get entertained here, you get fed” – a mature observation that has started their journey away from charismania too.

  73. Just discussing this blog with my husband and he reminded me that our minister tells us we are to follow the text of scripture as he teaches as he wants us to hold HIM accountable to the text, and we have the opportunity to ask questions after the sermons. When was the last time people had that opportunity at C3? We tried to ask questions (privately) and had no option but to leave.

  74. How Not To Throw Stones

    Read Matthew 18:15-20

    15 “If a brother or sister sins,go and point out the fault, just between the two of you. If they listen to you, you have won them over. 16 But if they will not listen, take one or two others along, so that ‘every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.’ 17 If they still refuse to listen, tell it to the church; and if they refuse to listen even to the church, treat them as you would a pagan or a tax collector.

    18 “Truly I tell you, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.

    19 “Again, truly I tell you that if two of you on earth agree about anything you ask for, it will be done for you by my Father in heaven. 20 For where two or three come together in my name, there am I with them.”

    When it comes to confronting misconduct in the church, it seems there are three approaches we take. One is to ignore the misconduct and say it is nothing to do with us. Mustn’t be busybodies after all. Another is to root out sin (especially anything to do with sex) with a ruthlessness that is light on compassion but heavy on proud condemnation. The third approach is to talk to everyone about it in the church and even outside with the exception of the person suspected of the misconduct.

    None of that works. One is apathetic: we do belong to one another after all. Another is bullying and suggests we toss out sinners because they remind us too much of our own more secret sins. And the third is a cowardly cop out: whispering assassination that diminishes everybody.

    Fortunately, this text gives us a better way. The emphasis on getting the other person into dialogue. After all, we might have the facts all wrong. So we don’t jump in to condemn. We first seek private discussion, and only bring in others when all else fails. Sadly, it might be that we have to regard the other person as an ‘outsider’, at least for a time. Though note here that God has a special love and concern for such ‘pagans and tax collectors’. Jesus demonstrates that. The overall emphasis is not winning an argument or making the person feel bad. It is all about getting them to come to their senses, winning them over.

    This can only happen if we act with the heart and authority of Jesus. This passage tells us that our godly decisions on earth are ratified in heaven. And it also tells us that when we prayerfully confront another person with others, then Jesus will be with us. Confronting a person about their failures is a necessary but delicate business. We need Jesus’ authority and help. And we are promised it.

    Perhaps we need to remind ourselves also of Jesus’ earlier teaching about ensuring the plank in our own eye is being removed even as we pursue the specks in others’ eyes. We are all in danger of stumbling. If you stumbled, what would you prefer? Indifference? Condemnation? Death by gossip? Or being approached by someone who loves you enough to lift you out of the pit, and someone who knows themselves well enough not to throw stones at you while you are in the pit?

  75. I wish there was a like button Wanda. Great comment.

    You may be interested in this article I wrote about ‘Casting the First Stone’ here:


  76. Richmond: “But now YOU’RE judging a person for judging! Doesn’t that make you a hypocrite for calling him a hypocrite for judging?”

    No. My definition of love includes the ability to judge so we can be made responsible and accountable to one another. Love includes judgment.

    The general attitude towards me is ‘love not judge’. Here what was said to me:

    “1. My bible tells me the love you preach is not biblical love that is demonstrated by christ…who IS love…not has love.
    2. The holy spirit does not resonate in me with such blatent and slanderous attacks on men of God
    3. Discernment works both ways…a few people now have discerned you as coming not from the right spirit. Yet you refuse to go get help.

    If you do not like being criticised then do not become the critic of another….You are being judged by the same scriptural standard you are deeming to judge these men. Your interpretation of love comes up lacking of christ.”

    The irony with that statement is that it is indeed a slanderous claim to say I’ve slandered ‘men of God’. It’s easy to assume that without knowing the definition of ‘slander’, that this is what I am doing. But I am not.

    this is a definition of slander:
    Noun: The action or crime of making a false spoken statement damaging to a person’s reputation.
    Verb: Make false and damaging statements about (someone).

    I have NOT slandered these men. The definition of slander proves that I haven’t. This is fact. This is me not speaking in denial. But people wish to deny this basic fact and believe what they want to believe on this.

    The above comment was made to judge me for judging and not being loving. However, that person judged me as ‘lacking of Christ’ but was apparently loving me? In fact, they carefully said they ‘discerned’ me as not coming from the right spirit.

    That is a judgment. That is a criticism. And that can be considered as slander. This is not be based on any fact and has been made up to discredit me. But obviously this is them speaking in ‘love’?

    I don’t mind criticism – I had to expect that if I do anything about leaders or pastors both right or wrong. I do mind if it’s just name-calling, slanderous, snaring, bullying or demonizing.

    This is what certain ministers do as well and endorse this type of behaviour to flow to their followers. Be aware of this mindset before commenting please.

    This is all I ask. Criticise my approach or actual things that you think I deserve criticism for doing. Don’t think this is now your right to demonise me, stir the nest or make a mockery of me.

    This actually reflects the heart attitude of C3 church attendees. Don’t keep making your church look bad by making such as, “I am wondering whether Jake was Breastfed as a child”.

    Those comments make your church look bad. Please stop.

  77. What a train wreck……I don’t understand this blog??!! So is this Jake Elliot guy is a “backsliden christian”? Did he go to C3 and somthing terrible happen? someone please explain..

    I am a journalist (I am not a christian) but have been doing research into church culture as a model for business and networking relationships for a number of documentaries and journals. Everything i had found about building networks, teams etc was pretty positive until i found this blog. I think I will mention some of the “playful banter” on this blog in my stories. you guys sure seem like you hate each other.

    I assume that everyone here is willing to be published in my stories (after all that is what a blog is… publishing)??!!?? You will be referenced accordingly unless you specify otherwise.

    This has given me an interesting angle to go on…. Keep truckin!!!

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